30g Mini Carpet Biotope

[dshnarw]

My fiancee has given me a 30 breeder for my birthday...so what better way to use it than to expand the mini carpet tank? Here's the plan, as of about...a day of thinking:

 

Full on mini carpet biotope (the current 15g is just a reef tank full of mini carpets). This is essentially a lagoonal area, with sand/mud bottom, seagrasses, and small patches of coral. Water flow is strong and tidally influenced.

 

-black sand bottom with mixed shells - haven't seen pics of tapetum on black sand, but it seems possible for the area. Plus, I already have the sand, and I like the look better than white.

 

-sea grass/macroalgae plantings - I'll have to make some adjustments/fudge the grasses a bit, since it's apparently difficult to get the Pacific seagrasses, but I've got some stuff from the Caribbean/Keys that I can use in place.

 

-small live rock islands - not much, just enough to change it up a bit. Maybe a few corals on these, depends on what I can find on coral species in the same area.

 

-undecided: fish, other inverts

 

 

Tank setup...and this is where I need some help:

 

-3 bulkhead overflows, 2 returns (and maybe a spray bar). Not sure on sizing for these? (Aiming for total movement through the display of ~1500gph)

 

-15g sump with the majority of the live rock filtration, some chaeto, and space for mini carpets that have been recently cut.

 

Not sure that all 3 bulkheads and returns need to/should go to the sump - maybe closed loop setups instead, with about 300gph through the sump (this would be the spray bar return)?

 

-move the 150w sunpod over from the 15g, suspended over the tank (only way I can get light coverage).

 

 

Other questions:

 

Has anyone taken the plastic trim off these tanks? How does the glass look under it? Given the height of the tank, I doubt it provides any structural support, but I could always add some *nice* corner pieces and achieve the same support without it looking so.....obtrusive? if I start to worry about structural problems.

 

Who'd be willing to drill 5 holes in a tank for me, and how much $$ and do ya need to do it?

 

 

WOW that was longer than I expected...

 

Any comments/suggestions/concerns/questions are appreciated!

[jason the filter freak]

Great cant wait to see this

[dshnarw]

Great cant wait to see this

 

lol - me either

 

Update:

 

After a grand total of 1 big hour of sleep last night due to my take home midterm in radiogenic isotopes being due at 8am this morning (60+ hrs of work, and I still didn't get the answers right.... :( ), I came home this afternoon and, instead of sleeping like I should, I built a stand. The neighbors must surely hate me after the barrage of hammering for the last couple of hours.

 

Thus far, it seems rock solid (this after standing on it and literally jumping..remember - 1 hr of sleep - not the greatest judgement).

 

Guessed on dimensions very nicely - the height is perfect for viewing from the couch and chairs, while still short enough to work in easily

 

 

 

Anyone interested in drilling 5 holes (for 1" bulkheads)? LMK - I can pay in frags or $$!

 

 

 

EDIT: Pic!

Edited October 31, 2007 by dshnarw

[dshnarw]

Made up a plumbing diagram:

 

 

Goal is to have 1500gph total, 300-400 of that through the refugium.

 

The other 1200gph I want through the closed loops (so no powerheads in the tank).

 

 

Anyone know how to make a closed loop with reversible flow on a timer?

[lletellier]

sorry this is a little off topic but i'm curious about the black sand... I've heard it looks good at first and then gets really dirty and nasty looking quickly. Any experience with it? maybe a pic of what you are planning on using??

 

As for your diagram... could you used one pump and an OM 4 way?? I have no idea since i've never used one but doesn't it help vary the flow?

[dshnarw]

sorry this is a little off topic but i'm curious about the black sand... I've heard it looks good at first and then gets really dirty and nasty looking quickly. Any experience with it? maybe a pic of what you are planning on using??

 

As for your diagram... could you used one pump and an OM 4 way?? I have no idea since i've never used one but doesn't it help vary the flow?

 

 

I have the black sand in my 15g, and haven't had any issues with it looking bad (SeaChem's Gray Coast). Don't have any pics though, cause the tupperware collection recently overtook the tank to hold all the anemones, so for the last month or so, the sand has been hidden. I'm planning to mix in a fair amount of live rock chips, since they'll end up in the tank every time I go to pull another anemone off a rock, along with lots of shells. I think that'll break up the black sand enough to help if it starts looking weird.

 

Yeah - the OM 4-way would work really well, but I can't afford it on my grad student budget. My fiancee would shoot me were I to spend that much

 

Thanks for the input! Let me know if I don't make sense

 

I actually found a pic of one in the wild...on blackish sand!

Edited November 2, 2007 by dshnarw

[lletellier]

http://www.wamas.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=17800

[jason the filter freak]

Maybe I should start selling my roboscwds... anyway I'm going to have black sand in my new tank and it's going to look flippen awesome!

[dshnarw]

http://www.wamas.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=17800

 

Thanks! Off to convince the boss

 

Anyone else having trouble with that mini carpet image? I noticed it just popped up as IPB for me today, not showing the pic?

 

Update of the day: Took the top plastic trim off the tank...it'll take a couple weeks of cleaning but looks much nicer now. I'll leave the bottom trim on for stability, since it'll be hidden when I finish the stand.

[jason the filter freak]

Thanks! Off to convince the boss

 

Anyone else having trouble with that mini carpet image? I noticed it just popped up as IPB for me today, not showing the pic?

 

Update of the day: Took the top plastic trim off the tank...it'll take a couple weeks of cleaning but looks much nicer now. I'll leave the bottom trim on for stability, since it'll be hidden when I finish the stand.

 

Typically on tanks that big the plastic rim is there for a reason. I'm also not seeing the image.

[dshnarw]

Typically on tanks that big the plastic rim is there for a reason. I'm also not seeing the image.

 

Thanks, rehosted the image, so it should work now.

 

 

I'm planning to put some wood trim on the top corners that will match the stand. Really, it shouldn't be a problem, even on a tank as large as this because it's only 12" high.

[90OcReef]

Your plan looks very nice. I have a few mini tapetums myself. I would still be VERY afraid of not having the upper frame on that tank. It's not the height of the tank that is so important. It's the thickness of the glass that is the "make or break" factor. I think you really should re-consider going frameless on a 30 breeder. The glass is too thin for your desired end result. It's hard to justify not being safe when you have so much time, money and heart into a tank.

 

You might want to look into glass cages rimless tanks. They have a 40 Rimless for $100 and you can have your holes drilled wherever you want for a small fee. We have a 280 from glass cages that we are very happy with. We will be ordering another frag tank for our new house in about 2 weeks. glasscages.com may be a reasonable alternative for you.

 

Good Luck,

Jess

[dshnarw]

Your plan looks very nice. I have a few mini tapetums myself. I would still be VERY afraid of not having the upper frame on that tank. It's not the height of the tank that is so important. It's the thickness of the glass that is the "make or break" factor. I think you really should re-consider going frameless on a 30 breeder. The glass is too thin for your desired end result. It's hard to justify not being safe when you have so much time, money and heart into a tank.

 

You might want to look into glass cages rimless tanks. They have a 40 Rimless for $100 and you can have your holes drilled wherever you want for a small fee. We have a 280 from glass cages that we are very happy with. We will be ordering another frag tank for our new house in about 2 weeks. glasscages.com may be a reasonable alternative for you.

 

Good Luck,

Jess

 

 

Thanks! I appreciate the feedback.

 

Concerning the "frame" (more inclined to simply call it trim): The thickness of the glass is a concern, but it's still a concern based on the height of the tank, relative to the length/width of the tank. In this case - with the tank being only a foot high, but three feet by one and a half feet in length/width, the tank should be fine. I did some calculations for the minimum glass thickness, based on the length/height and width/height ratios:

 

This one has a safety factor of 3.8, which is the recommended value for bracless glass aquariums.

 

This one has a safety factor of 5.5, which is the maximum safety factor that created a minimum thickness below that of the tank:

 

These calculations were done for the minimum accepted tensile strengths of glass, as well, just for extra safety.

 

I'm actually not concerned with the glass holding up. I'm more concerned with the silicon holding, which is why I plan to use the "corner caps". Along with the bottom rim, it should be enough opposing pressure for the silicon to hold (certainly it would be as much as the cheap-o plastic). Water test will happen after the edges are cleaned up to ease my mind on the corner design, and others on the trimless design.

[jason the filter freak]

Where'd you get the nifty tables mister?

[dshnarw]

Where'd you get the nifty tables mister?

 

Made it based on Glass Thickness Calculations, checked against thermodynamics data from one of my textbooks for accuracy/precision.

 

I put it on my old website if you'd like to use it. First sheet, "calculations", contains the relevant data and information you'll need to get a required thickness. The second sheet, "instructions", tells you what data you need to enter, and where to enter it.

 

Link: Glass Calculator xls

Edited November 3, 2007 by dshnarw

[dshnarw]

Your plan looks very nice. I have a few mini tapetums myself. I would still be VERY afraid of not having the upper frame on that tank. It's not the height of the tank that is so important. It's the thickness of the glass that is the "make or break" factor. I think you really should re-consider going frameless on a 30 breeder. The glass is too thin for your desired end result. It's hard to justify not being safe when you have so much time, money and heart into a tank.

 

You might want to look into glass cages rimless tanks. They have a 40 Rimless for $100 and you can have your holes drilled wherever you want for a small fee. We have a 280 from glass cages that we are very happy with. We will be ordering another frag tank for our new house in about 2 weeks. glasscages.com may be a reasonable alternative for you.

 

Good Luck,

Jess

 

 

Oh....I should add in that I'm not a big fan of glasscages.com, and would be extremely hesitant to buy from them. They aren't in good standing with the Better Business Bureau in Tennessee (I lived an hour from Nashville before moving here) and several of the LFSs in Nashville recommended finding a different vendor because of the number of complaints they'd heard. Not saying they can't do good work, just seems like they have many more issues than other custom tank companies.

[dshnarw]

Well, college football was on all day yesterday, and I actually got to see some SEC games, so what better time to scrape silicone off the tank? Was an all day task with the razorblade, but I got the tank looking presentable. I should have done this after the water test, but I have to have something to do while watching football.

 

But anyhoo - Water testing has begun. No initial leaks. Glass is fine - the deflection on the side glass isn't noticeable, and only barely so with a straight edge against the glass. Just waiting to see if the silicone holds

 

 

I was thinking I'd leave it overnight before calling it a success, since it's in the bathroom and I would like to take a shower before the lab I teach tomorrow afternoon. (This is without the corner pieces. If/when I do add those, it'll just be that much stronger.)

[dshnarw]

A few pics from the ongoing water test!

 

(yes...I know the toilet seat is up...you can tell it's a guys apartment...)

 

 

 

THATS how you water test in an apartment

[jason the filter freak]

 

It seems that you have some sort of giant rat infestastion right there.

Great water test ! Question, how hard was it to build the stand, what was the approximate cost ? I need to build the same style stand

[dshnarw]

It seems that you have some sort of giant rat infestastion right there.

Great water test ! Question, how hard was it to build the stand, what was the approximate cost ? I need to build the same style stand

 

 

Yeah....that rat just won't go away. He nips too...

 

Cost was about $30 for the wood and the metal brackets. Already had the wood glue/nails. I had Lowe's do the cuts, since I don't have a saw around here (and there was NO way I was going to use a hand saw), and after that it was just a matter of glue/hammer. A few hours should be plenty, even if you work slow (this is really one of those "If I can do it, anyone can do it" things).

 

Stand dimensions are 36x18x27.

 

Wood sizes (all 2x4s):

4 @ 36" (long sides)

4 @ 11" (short sides)

8 @ 24" (uprights, 2 on each corner in an L shape)

 

brackets (have no idea what they're actually named, but they're in the middle of all the lumber at Lowe's):

8 90* corner brackets

8 90* elbow brackets

 

If you want, I can get better pics after the water test.

 

I'll finish the stand off with some finished plywood and trim to make it look nice once my fiancee decides what she wants it to look like.

[jason the filter freak]

 

 

(this is really one of those "If I can do it, anyone can do it" things).

 

 

This is exactly what I wanted to hear! Thanks, I wouldn't mind some more pics.

[arwndsh]

Since he has decided to talk about me so much in this thread I decided to join so I could have my own voice in this matter. Now since I am not in the great state of Maryland at the moment (gotta graduate first from Western) I have to keep him in check by reading his threads and looking at pictures.

 

And as for the big furry rat thats my baby, Gizmo. He is a 9 month old shih-tzu-brussles griffon mix.

 

And as for the really expensive 4 way controler, sorry no way right now. :(

 

As for the tank I just let him think its his.

 

Amber

Edited November 6, 2007 by arwndsh

[dshnarw]

Time for an update:

 

Hole drilling still needs to be done. steveoutlaw was going to do it (thanks!), but he's had job/family/hobby issues to deal with, so I'm still looking!

 

So, since I'm stalled on getting the tank drilled (and I can't find Indonesia live rock around here - anyone know a local provider?), I've started gathering livestock for the tank:

 

My favorite little Fungiidae: Halomitra clavator. I've had this thing for nearly a year - one of the first corals I bought when I restarted my tank, made it through the 12 hour move here, and a bleaching event. Looks like a normal Fungia, but has 30+ mouths (white) and is attached to the substrate. Found out it's native to Singapore in "sheltered areas", so it sounds like it can go in my Singapore mini carpet lagoon!

 

 

 

 

And, thanks to the Mr. Coral grand opening, I have the typical Fungia, as well:

 

which I've found pics of in the wild in Singapore, in the same area as the mini carpets:

Wildfilms: Underwater Mushroom Garden at Hantu

[gastone]

Daniel that first fungia that you posted is sick.

 

How is the tank coming?

 

Garrett.

[dshnarw]

Daniel that first fungia that you posted is sick.

 

How is the tank coming?

 

Garrett.

 

Thanks! I've never seen another like it on a hobbyist website...although RC is rather too cumbersome to thoroughly search.

 

Tank is coming along, slowly. I have all the equipment and plumbing supplies ready. As soon as I get some holes in it, I'll be able to transfer the 15g over to it. Hopefully soon, since my 15g-used-to-be-display is full of coral I'm holding for the tank upgrade.